EU Referendum Megathread (Brexit)

[-:Undertaker:-]

Hungary confirms it is to hold a referendum.

The European Commission is denouncing it in public... what the hell has the decision of Hungary to hold a referendum got to do with them!?

I do think its a shame what has become of the EU, if it had been run and organised better it could of done a lot of good and benefited everyone.

Indeed but those who want to stay in will lie and say it is reformable when it's not. In over 40 years of membership, what has Britain ever achieved by staying in?

Membership of the EEA or EFTA with Switzerland and Norway would suit us perfectly - it's just about trade for them!

[-:Undertaker:-]

A few updates.

The Canadian High Commissioner told me, in terms, that, outside the EU, the UK and Canada could agree a bilateral FTA almost immediately.

— Daniel Hannan (@DanielJHannan) February 28, 2016

As I have argued before on here, completing Free Trade Deals (FTAs) with the likes of Canada, Australia, New Zealand and India is both a certainty and we would be able to complete pretty quickly given our we all share Common English Law contrasted to us and Europe who have different legal systems. Given we're much more pro-free trade and flexible than continental Europe too, these deals would be much better than any hypothetical deals that the EU could attempt in the future. The French for example always block agricultural free trade to please French farmers, which is why we end up paying more for our food.

Another former Australian Prime Minister has come out for us to leave the EU so we can forge closer ties with the Commonwealth...

Ex-Aussie PM John Howard: Britain Should Leave ‘Fundamentally Flawed’ EU https://t.co/ueK9WsRmKF pic.twitter.com/ibRAE80Cr8

— Breitbart London (@BreitbartLondon) February 28, 2016

Former Conservative leader and Home Secretary Lord Howard has surprisingly come out in favour of British exit from the EU...

Former Conservative leader Michael Howard says he is backing a UK exit from the EU, saying David Cameron's... https://t.co/lM85DkjiNC

— BBC Politics (@BBCPolitics) February 25, 2016

And the Work and Pensions Minister Iain Duncan Smith has attacked the scaremongering of the Remain campaign...

Iain Duncan Smith says Remain campaign has “low opinion” of British people and its pitch is “ooh it’s terrible, hang onto nurse!"

— Isabel Hardman (@IsabelHardman) February 28, 2016

Finally the G20 issued a statement warning against the 'danger' of British exit from the EU to the global economy. Ignoring the fact most of the G20 nations aren't even in the European Union, it has transpired - unsurprisingly - that the British Government pushed for and wrote the letter and got the others to sign as a favour.

UK officials 'instigated G20 Brexit warning' https://t.co/BQyb90HWGC

— Alberto Nardelli (@AlbertoNardelli) February 28, 2016

[abc]

An Article by the former Foreign Minister of Norway. Perfect example of what will happen to us if we exit - keep paying the EU and move to the outer circle with little influence.
http://www.theguardian.com/commentis...orwegian-model

Those campaigning for Britain to leave the EU and chose the Norwegian way can hence correctly claim that a country can retain access to the single market from outside the EU. What is normally not said, however, is that this also means retaining all the EU’s product standards, financial regulations, employment regulations, and substantial contributions to the EU budget. A Britain choosing this track would, in other words, keep paying, it would be “run by Brussels”, and it would remain committed to the four freedoms, including free movement.

[-:Undertaker:-]

An Article by the former Foreign Minister of Norway. Perfect example of what will happen to us if we exit - keep paying the EU and move to the outer circle with little influence.
http://www.theguardian.com/commentis...orwegian-model

We don't have to take the EEA route though.

And that said, even if Britain joined the EEA or EFTA it would clearly transform those organisations into something else given our size and importance.

[abc]

We don't have to take the EEA route though.

And that said, even if Britain joined the EEA or EFTA it would clearly transform those organisations into something else given our size and importance.

If's, but's etc. Our influence would be much lower once we are alone.

PS - You posted every time the Out camp was doing well in polls but obviously you forgot the latest polls.

EU referendum: latest poll of polls gives In camp ten-point lead

The results show that 45 per cent of voters support Brexit, while 55 per cent would like the UK to remain in the European Union.

[-:Undertaker:-]

If's, but's etc. Our influence would be much lower once we are alone.

What "influence" has Britain had in 42 years of EEC/EU membership given it has gone way beyond a "trading community" which we were promised?

We count for 1 in 28 voices in the Council of Ministers and our vote in the EU Parliament is something like 8% (and decreasing) is it not? Influence where?

[abc]

What "influence" has Britain had in 42 years of EEC/EU membership given it has gone way beyond a "trading community" which we were promised?

We count for 1 in 28 voices in the Council of Ministers and our vote in the EU Parliament is something like 8% (and decreasing) is it not? Influence where?

See below considering you have always boasted about how well Norway do outside of EU.

Norway’s minister for Europe has warned Britain of serious consequences for economic and security policy if it leaves the European Union.

Before a visit to London, during which he will meet Foreign Office ministers and officials, Vidar Helgesen, Norway’s minister for the European Economic Area (EEA) and EU affairs, told the Observer that his country often found it difficult to shape economic rules that affected Norway – often cited by Eurosceptics as a shining example of how a nation can thrive outside the EU – while not being a member.

He also said that at a time of “burning security crisis not seen since the cold war”, most key meetings were now being convened at EU level, rather than within Nato, and it was vital that the UK was there to shape decisions.

Largely as a result of its oil resources, Norway is one of the wealthiest countries in Europe, with a higher per-capita income than the vast majority of its member states. British Eurosceptics often say the Norwegian experience is evidence of how a country outside the EU, but enjoying the benefits of the single market through membership of the EEA, can prosper without having to commit itself to full membership. Helgesen said, however, that this arrangement often created frustrations and difficulties, which meant Norwegian ministers and officials spent a lot of time – sometimes without success – trying to find out what was going on in EU meetings that would affect their country directly.

British Influence’s director, Peter Wilding, said: “Eurosceptics who peddle the myth that Norway is the best [model] for a non-EU Britain are deceiving the British public. They say leaving leads to more democracy and security. This is nonsense.

[-:Undertaker:-]

@abc;

Not one example of our much cited "influence". Look at the 'reforms' Cameron achieved. Meaningless and not even legally binding.



On Norway, the Norwegian public disagree with him of a margin something like 70% to 17%. If it is so bad as the politician portrays.......

In any case, you're giving way too much thought to the Norway-EEA option. I've stated before that EEA membership like Norway would be my least preferred option (other than current EU membership) and that Britain still has the option of EFTA (like Switzerland) or simply an FTA which would mean we'd have a relationship with the EU similar to that which New Zealand, Australia and America have. That seems to me to be perfectly fine and we'd not be included in Freedom of Movement either. Or alternatively us joining the EEA would give it much more clout and we'd be able to negotiate a much better deal both for ourselves and the Nordic countries.

I note that the picture you paint is not a positive one for the EU but "it is our only choice" ....is it really? We can do so much better.

[abc]

@abc;

Not one example of our much cited "influence". Look at the 'reforms' Cameron achieved. Meaningless and not even legally binding.



On Norway, the Norwegian public disagree with him of a margin something like 70% to 17%. If it is so bad as the politician portrays.......

In any case, you're giving way too much thought to the Norway-EEA option. I've stated before that EEA membership like Norway would be my least preferred option (other than current EU membership) and that Britain still has the option of EFTA (like Switzerland) or simply an FTA which would mean we'd have a relationship with the EU similar to that which New Zealand, Australia and America have. That seems to me to be perfectly fine and we'd not be included in Freedom of Movement either. Or alternatively us joining the EEA would give it much more clout and we'd be able to negotiate a much better deal both for ourselves and the Nordic countries.

I note that the picture you paint is not a positive one for the EU but "it is our only choice" ....is it really? We can do so much better.

An EU exit = uncertainty. Markets hate uncertainty. We would have to renegotiate like another 50 Trade deals. And due to the market uncertainty, the pound has already begun falling which is making our imports more expensive. I have not seen pound = $1.39 for a long long time and quite frankly it is going to cost me a lot of money as imports is my main business.

[-:Undertaker:-]

An EU exit = uncertainty. Markets hate uncertainty. And due to the market uncertainty, the pound has already begun falling which is making our imports more expensive. I have not seen pound = $1.39 for a long long time and quite frankly it is going to cost me a lot of money as imports is my main business.

And still no reasons for staying in the EU other than threatening the sky will fall in if we leave.

You've really lost the plot when you bring the movement of the GBP into it lmao, currencies move all the time. It's called speculative trading.

We would have to renegotiate like another 50 Trade deals.

Instead of looking at this with no confidence and laziness, why not look at this as a positive opportunity?

It's a great chance to regain our seat on the WTO and carve out very liberal and relaxed trading deals with countries across the world. Have some optimism!

Govt being silly now. Warns it would take 10 years to negotiate post-Brexit trade deals. 4 years longer than the Second World War?

— Iain Martin (@iainmartin1) February 28, 2016

I am actually very glad from a campaigning POV at the absurdity of the scaremongering by the Remain campaign already as it is blowing apart their credibility.