Business/Foreign Workers

[-:Undertaker:-]

Alright so.

The other day at the Conservative Party conference the Home Secretary announced plans to have businesses have to publish what percentage of their workforce was foreign. Now, if you went by the reaction on Twitter you'd think the public was 80% against with absurd lunatic statements like "next it will be yellow stars" being retweeted around the place.

Well, YouGov did some polling and here's what a representative sample - not left wing Twitter - of the public think.

59% of people back Conservative proposals to make firms publish how many foreign workers they employ https://t.co/yk1XCOQ0pA pic.twitter.com/5bqjCYvuwd

— YouGov (@YouGov) October 6, 2016

In further news, 60% of people think a company should hire a British candidate over an equally qualified foreign one https://t.co/CYILyx2NnI pic.twitter.com/eVm5qT5WMw

— Matthew Smith (@mattsmithetc) October 6, 2016

Majority of the public support proposals to have businesses publish number of foreign workers - inc Lab/LD voters https://t.co/yk1XCOQ0pA pic.twitter.com/IpBrbdHWmf

— YouGov (@YouGov) October 6, 2016

Moral of the story? Don't confuse social media for national opinion.

I don't think the plans will do much and there's more to be done with controlling immigration but I do think we should be entitled to ask why a low-skilled factory in a deprived town on the eastern coast is employing 50, 60, 90% foreign workers when the unemployment figures in that said town are 40% or more. That's a legitimate question.

Thoughts?

[lawrawrrr]

Do you know what's hilarious

It's that bloody misleading Times headline prompting everyone to massively freak out and hate the Tories for keeping some dodgy list of foreign workers which to some of them idiots means ALL people with other nationalities not just immigrants? Had to stop reading Facebook a couple times cos of it, got so annoyed but not interested in starting some argument with some young politico with a massive anti-Tory bias "just cos" rather than looking at the damn facts

OK RANT OVER

Why shouldn't businesses publish this? They have to record loads of others, gender, nationality, disabilities, religion/sexual orientation - although some of them are the employee's right to disclose I suppose. I think gender they have to report actually.

I actually completely agree with you that the public should be aware of how many FOREIGN (aka: NON RESIDENTS OF THE UK) people work in certain places, including the "disgusting" NHS plans because why shouldn't the public be aware of how many non-residents are occupying jobs created in the UK for UK people?

I mean I could massively be misunderstanding this but it's not like Nazi Germany, they're not asking these foreign workers to walk around with a pink triangle on their arm, it's all anonymous it's not a list of names (bloody Times headline once again)


also: wtf does foreign even mean I'm assuming it means non resident workers or outsourced work / work visa etc rather than legal immigrants... if it's legal immigrants then I genuinely don't believe the tories would do this?? Although I still see zero issue with reporting it, it will just create unnecessary vitriol while people misunderstand the meaning of "foreign" workers

[FlyingJesus]

Publishing data doesn't necessarily mean that anyone's gonna get penalised for having too few or too many of X person anyway surely

[AgnesIO]

I think it is very rare for a firm ti hire a foreign worker over an equally qualified foreign one without any other reason...

Getting a job is as much about personality, approach etc as it is to do about being qualified.

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Do you know what's hilarious

It's that bloody misleading Times headline prompting everyone to massively freak out and hate the Tories for keeping some dodgy list of foreign workers which to some of them idiots means ALL people with other nationalities not just immigrants? Had to stop reading Facebook a couple times cos of it, got so annoyed but not interested in starting some argument with some young politico with a massive anti-Tory bias "just cos" rather than looking at the damn facts

OK RANT OVER

Why shouldn't businesses publish this? They have to record loads of others, gender, nationality, disabilities, religion/sexual orientation - although some of them are the employee's right to disclose I suppose. I think gender they have to report actually.

I actually completely agree with you that the public should be aware of how many FOREIGN (aka: NON RESIDENTS OF THE UK) people work in certain places, including the "disgusting" NHS plans because why shouldn't the public be aware of how many non-residents are occupying jobs created in the UK for UK people?

I mean I could massively be misunderstanding this but it's not like Nazi Germany, they're not asking these foreign workers to walk around with a pink triangle on their arm, it's all anonymous it's not a list of names (bloody Times headline once again)


also: wtf does foreign even mean I'm assuming it means non resident workers or outsourced work / work visa etc rather than legal immigrants... if it's legal immigrants then I genuinely don't believe the tories would do this?? Although I still see zero issue with reporting it, it will just create unnecessary vitriol while people misunderstand the meaning of "foreign" workers

Since when were NHS jobs created "in the UK for UK people"?

[lawrawrrr]

I think it is very rare for a firm ti hire a foreign worker over an equally qualified foreign one without any other reason...

Getting a job is as much about personality, approach etc as it is to do about being qualified.

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Since when were NHS jobs created "in the UK for UK people"?

Well surely, jobs are created in a country for that country's residents to be employed so they can not be reliant on the government (benefits etc)? When I say for UK people I mean residents of the U.K., not just people with historical heritage.

I know there's the whole like right to work thing from the EU and we are reliant on a lot of overseas doctors and nurses which is obviously what we need, but if they're being hired cos they're cheap over an equally qualified doctor from the UK then that's a flaw in our system IMO.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[AgnesIO]

Well surely, jobs are created in a country for that country's residents to be employed so they can not be reliant on the government (benefits etc)? When I say for UK people I mean residents of the U.K., not just people with historical heritage.

I know there's the whole like right to work thing from the EU and we are reliant on a lot of overseas doctors and nurses which is obviously what we need, but if they're being hired cos they're cheap over an equally qualified doctor from the UK then that's a flaw in our system IMO.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

How many student doctors do you know of that can't find a job?

They're not being employed because they're cheaper; they're being employed because we don't have enough. Why don't we have enough? Because our education system does not produce students with good enough qualifications or work ethic. Why is this? Because kids have it far too easy in school.

It isn't anything to do with foreigners.

[Empired]

How many student doctors do you know of that can't find a job?

They're not being employed because they're cheaper; they're being employed because we don't have enough. Why don't we have enough? Because our education system does not produce students with good enough qualifications or work ethic. Why is this? Because kids have it far too easy in school.

It isn't anything to do with foreigners.

Actually at my fathers care home we've been told by the staff (who are all foreign; there is not a single person on my dad's floor whose native language is English) that they are chosen over residents of the UK because UK residents demand higher pay. But that's only one example that's personal to me, I couldn't produce any stats or make any generalisations about the country but I still think that's pretty shocking.

[AgnesIO]

Actually at my fathers care home we've been told by the staff (who are all foreign; there is not a single person on my dad's floor whose native language is English) that they are chosen over residents of the UK because UK residents demand higher pay. But that's only one example that's personal to me, I couldn't produce any stats or make any generalisations about the country but I still think that's pretty shocking.

And what wages are our workers asking for?

In any case, I was referring more to doctors etcetera (where we don't have enough). There is a big difference between that and being a low-level staff member (the original post referred specifically to nurses and doctors). I don't know of any nurses who are struggling to find a job, nor any doctors.

[wixard]

it's easy for you all to say you think the outrage is ridiculous when it's not your name on the list

my name will be one of the names demanding to be listed, and I don't particularly think it's fair that an english person with the same qualifications gets automatically chosen over myself.

like what agnes io said, what if my personality is more fit for the job? but i'm not british, so i automatically get placed behind them? and lets just say that's not even the case, that's still how i've been made feel and at the moment i feel extremely unwelcome

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just to add, i don't think the whole 'list being made public' is a bad idea with regard to finding employers who are exploiting the system, it's how it's suddenly been put to the public and DEMANDED

and how the entire attitude surrounding it is BRITISH PEOPLE FIRST
i have two degrees and studied for one of them in your country, i think i have just as much a right to work there don't you

[AgnesIO]

and how the entire attitude surrounding it is BRITISH PEOPLE FIRST
i have two degrees and studied for one of them in your country, i think i have just as much a right to work there don't you

Waiting for someone to say "yes, but your culture is more aligned to ours, so you are fine", and then they will claim they are not simply being xenophobic :rolleyes: